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mulderc 54 minutes ago [-]
Cars have become absurd. We have an older car, and I occasionally look at what we could replace it with, and everything is huge and expensive. Literally, the only car I have been interested in is from BYD and will never be available in my country.
gravypod 12 minutes ago [-]
Mitsubishi just discontinued the car line that I drive [0]. The Mirage was great. I can drive from NYC to Boston on ~10 gallon. The only downsides were: No arm wrest, no sunglasses holder, and the media console won't turn on if you leave the car in the hot sun for a while.
I'm hoping to make my next car an electric car but all of the US ones are massive.
Last year I purchased an electric scooter to complement my car. I ran into mechanical trouble with my car, and it wasn't worth repairing. Instead of replacing it with another car, I have ended up complementing the shortcomings of the electric scooter with an acoustic bicycle. In particular, the bike is better for carrying cargo (I can put things on the bike or even in a trailer instead of just a backpack; I have even moved furniture with my trailer!), and better at dealing with weather (I never have to worry about the battery getting cold or wet, and I also have studded tires for ice).
If I knew I were getting rid of my car, I probably would have gotten an e-bike instead of an e-scooter. Having both has been quite nice though and they complement each other to be better than just having an e-bike. Depending on your cargo carrying / passenger needs, a cargo e-bike or a regular e-bike may be a much cheaper way to replace your car, and may be much more practical than you expect!
comradesmith 17 minutes ago [-]
Get a Honda Civic Type R
Thlom 47 minutes ago [-]
BYD also have some humongus cars. I have the BYD Tang and it's too big for some parking spaces.
chrystalkey 36 minutes ago [-]
Hey so, why would you even buy that? Was that some external requirement?
mulderc 19 minutes ago [-]
BYD also has very reasonably sized cars like the Dolphin.
moffkalast 42 minutes ago [-]
From what I've ridden in the newer models it seems like internal cabin space remains the same or is genuinely getting smaller, but crumple zones keep increasing in size. There has to be some kind of ever increasing safety bar that keeps rising every year and this is the malicious compliance they're getting in response.
In 2100 every car will have a total of 1 person of internal space, span the size of a city block and will be made entirely of cotton balls to achieve a 4 star safety rating. For the 5 star rating you also have to make sure the driver is immortal so they can't die of old age.
MSKJ 37 minutes ago [-]
There is no malicious compliance, just compliance. Who would they be malicious to? There is enough competition, it would only hurt their bottom line
bobthepanda 18 minutes ago [-]
part of the problem, at least in the US, is that the SUVs destroy other cars, so it is quickly becoming a weird safety arms race.
the_mitsuhiko 39 minutes ago [-]
The wild thing for me is that we just recently bought an XC90 and an American friend asked me how we're managing with three kids in a "compact SUV". That car is about as large as cars get over here for the most part.
frollogaston 19 minutes ago [-]
Weird, XC90 wouldn't normally be considered a compact SUV here in the US
oatmeal1 37 minutes ago [-]
We need a pigouvian tax based on vehicle weight to address the increased deaths due to noise pollution, collisions, and increased wear to roads.
j13n 15 minutes ago [-]
And credits or rebates for vehicles with improved safety features?
I assume the 18-tonne lorries that move most of the world’s goods would be exempt, too, or would you pass that cost on to consumers? Just make everything a bit more expensive for everyone.
oatmeal1 2 minutes ago [-]
Subsidies for using non-car transit would make more sense (health benefits in addition to safety and savings).
>I assume the 18-tonne lorries that move most of the world’s goods would be exempt, too, or would you pass that cost on to consumers? Just make everything a bit more expensive for everyone.
The demand for large vehicles is inelastic in the short term, but over the long term, more alternatives would be found and the share of the burden to consumers would reduce. Remember also the savings on road maintenance that consumers that pay taxes must pay for.
wolvoleo 11 minutes ago [-]
In most countries in the EU weight is already a major factor in road tax though some have changed it to emissions.
And yes lorries are billed lower for road tax otherwise they couldn't exist.
trgn 24 minutes ago [-]
weight is the easiest measure. wear&tear on road, mpg, damage in accident all scale with weight
avidiax 11 minutes ago [-]
> scale with weight
Road damage scales with axle weight to the fourth power (w^4).
So if a 500lbs motorcycle is the unit of damage, a 4,000 lbs sedan does 4,096 units of damage (4096x as much), a 6,000 lbs SUV/pickup does 20,736x, a 14,000 lbs delivery van does 614,000x, and the 80,000 lbs US federal limit 5 axle semi-trailer does 90,800,000x the damage of the motorcycle.
So probably shipping stuff in trucks doesn't cost enough, and SUVs/pickups should cost 5x for road tax what sedans do.
TacticalCoder 4 minutes ago [-]
> So probably shipping stuff in trucks doesn't cost enough, and SUVs/pickups should cost 5x for road tax what sedans do.
Nope because the numbers you just posted exemplify what every knows: road cars don't even register on the radar compared to semi-trailers.
The tax for "road damage" should be approximately zero for cars, any cars, and way more expensive for semis.
But people who hate on cars don't want to hear the truth: they're all too happy to take their bicycle to go buy the milk the semis brought to their city.
kiddico 34 minutes ago [-]
Deaths from noise pollution?
inigyou 24 minutes ago [-]
Stress, and so on. No individual death would be attributable, only a statistical increase.
astrospective 21 minutes ago [-]
Air pollution would be easier to quantify brake and tire dust are big urban air pollutants.
wolvoleo 20 minutes ago [-]
And this is in EU, not even America where cars have always been tanks.
I do think we will see fewer on the road though. In my city more and more streets are being pedestrianised. And unlimited public transport is only 24€ and amazing quality. Most of the people who still drive are rich foreigners that don't know any better. And also still view them as a status symbol.
Outside cities public transport isn't great though but it would be amazing if we would see car ownership decline by say 50% by 2040. Even electric cars aren't exactly good for the environment and cities become a lot more livable without cars.
The Germans will be pissed but they'll have to find new things to sell :)
What’s even more absurd is the Chinese vehicles in the same class have better tech and prices. German auto manufacturing is cooked unless they manage to legally block the Chinese in their primary markets.
wackget 28 minutes ago [-]
I'd happily drive a Chinese car but I've yet to see one which has physical buttons for controls. They all seem to have gigantic tablet displays. I categorically refuse to buy a car where I can't adjust the climate controls while keeping my eyes on the road.
shiandow 47 minutes ago [-]
That could be tricky because I think one of those markets was China.
47 minutes ago [-]
vel0city 50 minutes ago [-]
Eh. Old American sedans were often longer. A '77 Ford LTD was almost 5.5M in length, while this is only 5.3.
I guess I do agree those were insane monsters of vehicles. I couldn't imagine driving one of those today in urban areas.
frollogaston 22 minutes ago [-]
Apparently my 2009 Crown Vic is slightly longer than this Audi. I get more annoyed at how tall modern cars are.
bitwize 57 minutes ago [-]
And yet still in the standard "Jeep Grand Cherokee melted in the sun" shape. I wouldn't mind so much if the popular land yachts of decades past like the 1957 Cadillac Eldorado were revived, but today's most common passenger vehicles are still being made in the same boring sad-beige-mom shapes.
pseudohadamard 5 days ago [-]
[flagged]
lotsofpulp 51 minutes ago [-]
That kind of discourse is welcome to stay on Reddit.
chrystalkey 43 minutes ago [-]
Oh Look, there is a tree sized pole that sticks out of your rear side, might want to have a doctor look at it
crote 47 minutes ago [-]
Don't like a comment? No need to complain, just downvote or flag.
> Please don't post comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. It's a semi-noob illusion, as old as the hills.
And the windows keep getting smaller, the beltlines higher, the seats more cramped, though I don't have statistics to back up any of that.
rwyinuse 21 minutes ago [-]
Meanwhile the size of residential parking slots usually stays the same for decades after being built. I had "fun" of living in an apartment complex built in the 60's, one could only barely fit modern cars to the designated spots.
consp 23 minutes ago [-]
Good then that all vehicles over 6m length and 2.05m wide are not allowed to park in my city. It's good most pickups have custom wide tires, as it makes them too wide.
rplnt 35 minutes ago [-]
There's little to no incentive to buy human sized cars usually. Parking costs the same, tolls can cost the same, insurance I have no idea but I don't think size matters, and perhaps more. All of these should be more expensive, much more expensive, for bigger and heavier cars.
theodric 30 minutes ago [-]
Perhaps in the United States, but in a number of European countries, weight is a primary factor in determining annual road tax costs, which can reach into the thousands of Euros. If they keep making cars bigger, they will inevitably become heavier.
volkk 40 minutes ago [-]
we're slowly moving towards a world where people can't afford homes so they'll just be living out of their cars. guarantee that some car manufacturers are already considering/getting ready for this.
inigyou 23 minutes ago [-]
If only that wasn't illegal.
volkk 19 minutes ago [-]
i can easily see a world where this changes and some genius president will say it's a great idea, and look how great cars are now, they can do everything! live in your cars people!
inigyou 13 minutes ago [-]
You'd have to elect the CEO of Ford instead of a real estate guy.
testing22321 37 minutes ago [-]
Towards? You need to see how many people are doing vanlife, not by choice.
inigyou 22 minutes ago [-]
How do they navigate the legal minefield?
xboxnolifes 8 minutes ago [-]
Move the van when a police officer knocks on the window.
kettlez 14 minutes ago [-]
A Tacoma is now the size of an F-150, they used to be the size of a Ford Ranger. It's ridiculous.
trickypr 39 minutes ago [-]
Australia has a similar issue, in part because we import a lot of US domestic vehicles and advertising, and in part because the ato has tax exemptions that only apply to overbuilt utes[1].
That’s part of the picture, but the US also has a considerable “my vehicle is an extension of myself” or “my vehicle is a major pillar of my identity” thing going on. That’s how we ended up with so many pavement princess trucks and SUVs shoehorned in where a minivan or hatchback would’ve been a better fit.
tonyedgecombe 46 minutes ago [-]
Years ago Chrysler did some research on who was buying their SUV's and it wasn't very flattering. The terms narcissism, insecurity, status seeking and aggression all came up.
The height of hoods is at least in part because of pedestrian safety standards. I believe these originated in Europe, but I could be wrong.
Havoc 46 minutes ago [-]
>I believe these originated in Europe
Not this kind of higher. The EU stuff was about lifting the hood's sheet metal off the engine block so that there is more of a crumple zone instead of pedestrian's head kissing engine block
jerlam 58 minutes ago [-]
Higher hoods are worse, not better, for pedestrians.
bobthepanda 16 minutes ago [-]
to put this in perspective;
a lower hood will strike somewhere lower on the body like the legs, and bounce them off the hood (absorbing some impact)
a higher hood will strike somewhere closer to the head and torso, causing substantially more damage, and cause you to go under and get crushed by the wheels, so at a minimum level damage is much more severe.
and this is for adults. they're basically death sentences for shorter people and children.
cherioo 47 minutes ago [-]
I hate this because my parking space, both at the company and at home, are not getting any wider or taller. I chose to purchase my EV6 over the Equinox EV, despite the Equinox being significantly cheaper, mainly because latter was too big (and also worse driving experience).
I'm hoping to make my next car an electric car but all of the US ones are massive.
[0] - https://www.mitsubishicars.com/mirage-history
Last year I purchased an electric scooter to complement my car. I ran into mechanical trouble with my car, and it wasn't worth repairing. Instead of replacing it with another car, I have ended up complementing the shortcomings of the electric scooter with an acoustic bicycle. In particular, the bike is better for carrying cargo (I can put things on the bike or even in a trailer instead of just a backpack; I have even moved furniture with my trailer!), and better at dealing with weather (I never have to worry about the battery getting cold or wet, and I also have studded tires for ice).
If I knew I were getting rid of my car, I probably would have gotten an e-bike instead of an e-scooter. Having both has been quite nice though and they complement each other to be better than just having an e-bike. Depending on your cargo carrying / passenger needs, a cargo e-bike or a regular e-bike may be a much cheaper way to replace your car, and may be much more practical than you expect!
In 2100 every car will have a total of 1 person of internal space, span the size of a city block and will be made entirely of cotton balls to achieve a 4 star safety rating. For the 5 star rating you also have to make sure the driver is immortal so they can't die of old age.
I assume the 18-tonne lorries that move most of the world’s goods would be exempt, too, or would you pass that cost on to consumers? Just make everything a bit more expensive for everyone.
>I assume the 18-tonne lorries that move most of the world’s goods would be exempt, too, or would you pass that cost on to consumers? Just make everything a bit more expensive for everyone.
The demand for large vehicles is inelastic in the short term, but over the long term, more alternatives would be found and the share of the burden to consumers would reduce. Remember also the savings on road maintenance that consumers that pay taxes must pay for.
And yes lorries are billed lower for road tax otherwise they couldn't exist.
Road damage scales with axle weight to the fourth power (w^4).
So if a 500lbs motorcycle is the unit of damage, a 4,000 lbs sedan does 4,096 units of damage (4096x as much), a 6,000 lbs SUV/pickup does 20,736x, a 14,000 lbs delivery van does 614,000x, and the 80,000 lbs US federal limit 5 axle semi-trailer does 90,800,000x the damage of the motorcycle.
So probably shipping stuff in trucks doesn't cost enough, and SUVs/pickups should cost 5x for road tax what sedans do.
Nope because the numbers you just posted exemplify what every knows: road cars don't even register on the radar compared to semi-trailers.
The tax for "road damage" should be approximately zero for cars, any cars, and way more expensive for semis.
But people who hate on cars don't want to hear the truth: they're all too happy to take their bicycle to go buy the milk the semis brought to their city.
I do think we will see fewer on the road though. In my city more and more streets are being pedestrianised. And unlimited public transport is only 24€ and amazing quality. Most of the people who still drive are rich foreigners that don't know any better. And also still view them as a status symbol.
Outside cities public transport isn't great though but it would be amazing if we would see car ownership decline by say 50% by 2040. Even electric cars aren't exactly good for the environment and cities become a lot more livable without cars.
The Germans will be pissed but they'll have to find new things to sell :)
> 5.31m long, 2.21m wide and 1.81m tall
vs. the Humvee, according to Wikipedia:
- 4.57m long, 2.15m wide and 1.83m tall
I guess I do agree those were insane monsters of vehicles. I couldn't imagine driving one of those today in urban areas.
> Please don't post comments saying that HN is turning into Reddit. It's a semi-noob illusion, as old as the hills.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
[1]: https://www.drive.com.au/caradvice/ute-tax-breaks-exemptions...
Not this kind of higher. The EU stuff was about lifting the hood's sheet metal off the engine block so that there is more of a crumple zone instead of pedestrian's head kissing engine block
a lower hood will strike somewhere lower on the body like the legs, and bounce them off the hood (absorbing some impact)
a higher hood will strike somewhere closer to the head and torso, causing substantially more damage, and cause you to go under and get crushed by the wheels, so at a minimum level damage is much more severe.
and this is for adults. they're basically death sentences for shorter people and children.